betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 Hola, estaba leyendo unos blogs y me encontré con una nota interesante sobre la piratería y me pareció importante compartirla con esta comunidad, ya que en Costa Rica todo el mundo se toma el tema muy a la ligera. Por favor leanla toda y piensen un poco en cada punto. Gracias. Copy-Paste.... It's easy, free, and no-one is going to catch me This isn't a defence I hear in favour of piracy, but I thought I would start here as it is the reason that piracy is so prolific. I know piracy is easy. I'm sure I've got a freeware program at home that can copy DVD's if I wanted to, and if I don't, I'm guessing I could find one on the internet pretty quickly. Or I could probably just download movies and PC games straight to the hard drive. Perhaps you know a mass pirate who sells them for cheap, or perhaps your mate just hands you a free copy. And you are right, for the average person who owns pirated media (i.e. is not a mass reseller) you are unlikely to be on any authorities radar. They aren't interested in you, they want the guy selling hundreds or thousands of counterfeit items a week. So, it's easy, and you are unlikely to get caught. So what happens if you are presented with an opportunity to steal someone's wallet? Someone's bike? Someone's food? In those cases, if you know there is no way that they can pin the crime on you, do you steal it? (Note : If you would, don't bother reading any further, you won't learn anything). Usually peoples response if asked this is... But it doesn't hurt anyone That's a misguided blanket statement, and for a long time I've been unsure how people convince themselves that this is true. I think the problem is derived from the fact that nearly all of us know what it is like to be deprived of a physical product. Most of us have been through the unfortunate experience of having something stolen. In short, it sucks. We have to go without, or spend money and time to replace it. We've all owned physical items. I'd say more than 99.9% of us do not own any legal intellectual properties. As such, most people don't relate, and only see that they are not depriving another specific individual of the property, and thus don't see it as theft. Think about it for a moment. Think about something creative you have done. Or something creative you could have done. Maybe an idea in your head that you think is worth something. If someone got hold of your work, or caught wind of your idea and turned it into something and was able to sell it, wouldn't you want to be paid for inventing it in the first place? There are a whole range of people, and the industry in general, that are hurt by piracy. So perhaps a refinement of this argument is... Well, all those stars and companies earn megabucks anyway. So Tom Cruise earns more than you. Does that mean you are allowed to say he should earn less royalties by pirating his film? If you believe he is overpaid, then perhaps the homeless deserve to take your money seeing as you are better off than them. Those companies might show some pretty big profits, but those profits are usually divided up between a large number of shareholders. Of course, it isn't just those people who are affected by less sales. What about cinemas? With counterfeit copies available sometimes before movies even hit the cinema, or at best the next day, you can bet it has an effect on their numbers, including how many staff they can employ. The same goes for the rental industry and your local video store. While I think the stars deserve their money, it's your local video shops and cinemas that are going to be hit harder in the hip pocket. People wouldn't have bought it anyway So they weren't willing to listen/watch/play it if it involved any money, but if it is 'free', then they will take it? Even if these things don't cost any money, they do take up a far more precious resource; time. Thus, they already decided it was worth paying attention to instead of something else. Assume for a moment that a failsafe security measure is introduced that prevents pirating of PC software. Do the freeloaders who never paid a cent for software suddenly lose all interest in gaming? I doubt it. They may be more discerning than when it was 'free', but if such a pipe dream occurred, I'd say there is a much higher chance they will put some money into the industry instead of dropping out of it entirely. When companies tout how many pirate copies of their product is out there, I'm not foolish, and I don't expect all of them would have bought it if a pirate copy was unavailable. But some of them would have. Whether it is 10%, 1% or 0.1% of them, all the companies and individuals involved in the product deserve their slice. If I have a pirate copy and I like it enough, I will buy a legitimate copy. This is usually said about games. Sorry, but I say bollocks. Obviously people who say this have different criteria for when a game is 'worth it', but there is plenty of information out there to help you decide whether a game is for you without resorting to piracy. You can read Gamespots review, you can read other critics reviews, you can read player reviews, you can view gameplay footage, there may be demo's available, or you can rent it first. All these resources should give you a pretty good idea whether you will like a game and is worth your money and time. I imagine most people who say this very rarely actually pay for games that they do enjoy. What I do has almost no effect on the industry. The illegal copy you have might affect a few dozen people involved in that project for a cent or so each. That's pretty harmless, isn't it? And you are absolutely correct. If one person has an illegal copy of every movie, game or CD in the world, it will have negligible economic impact. The problem is that worldwide, it isn't just one person, it's millions. Do you mind if I take a cent out of your bank account? No? Would you mind if a million people did? I can't afford to go to the cinemas and I don't want to wait for the DVD. This doesn't happen to games a lot, but it is possible, such as the leaked PC code for Assassin's Creed before the game was shipped. But it does happen to movies all the time, and someone manages to get a master copy out, or camcorder versions make their way into the marketplace. I don't understand how anyone can watch these camcorder versions anyway; if you've spent money on a home theatre system, why would you even bother with these movies that do your investment a gross injustice? Maybe I just have more patience than others, but I don't understand why people can't wait a few months for a legitimate DVD release. The copy protection on the game is ludicrous, and requires me to jump through too many hoops. While I'm not a PC gamer and thus have not had to deal with this problem personally, I do feel for the people in this position. If this is your only complaint and you don't subscribe to any of the other claims I've raised here, I suggest that even if you do obtain a cracked version of the game for ease of use, that you do purchase a legitimate copy as well. You would also do well to advise the developer/publisher that you have done so. Let them know that you are willing to support their core product with your dollars, but the way they implement these features must be improved if they want to sell you their next game. The threat of losing a paying customer has much more impact than someone who wasn't going to give them a cent anyway. I don't want to pay for it if it isn't going to run on my PC Another legitimate concern. Obviously local law and store policy plays a part here regarding whether the game can be returned if it does not run on your system. I would hope that most PC games have demos that allow players to evaluate the performance, but I guess not all do. If such a demo doesn't exist and local law/store policy does not favour you and you feel you must head down this path, try to hold yourself to a higher standard. Treat it like a demo, play a level or half an hours worth of gameplay, and if it runs and you like it enough, go buy it. If it weren't for piracy, I wouldn't have heard of this band. Piracy gave this band more circulation, and they wouldn't be as popular as they are now without it. This argument is obviously specific to music, and may even have had some merit a decade ago. Now music is so much more accessible. Any time someone asks me if I have heard a band, they don't need to give me a copy; I turn to legal sources on the internet. The vast majority of bands have embraced the likes of youtube and myspace, and usually have their own website. Look them up, and no doubt you will find a plethora of their tracks or at the very least samples legally available for you to listen to before you buy tracks/albums. Games/music/DVD's are too expensive. I wouldn't mind a top of the range sports car (among countless other desirable items), but I'm not going to steal one just because I can't afford it. You either think they are worth the asking price, or they aren't. Such entertainment is a luxury, not a right. Companies can sell these products for whatever price they like. Buy second hand games, or wait for them to come down in price. Rent your movies or games. There are plenty of free games available on PC; you can start in Gamespot's download section. You might have to dig for quality, but there are plenty of browser-based and flash games. Some counterfeits are hard to distinguish I thought I would mention this as a challenge to reducing out piracy. While some people may intentionally buy what they know are pirate discs, some people who own pirated discs may not even realise it. People who aren't in the know can be fooled by a decent looking cover and a well-printed label slapped on the disc. Even I may have fallen prey. I bought a DS game on ebay, which arrived sealed. Upon looking at the instruction manual, I was puzzled by its contents, including the fact that it highlighted the games flaws. After thinking I had read the information before, I found that it was Gamespot's review of the game copied verbatim. Even being in the know, I still don't know whether it is counterfeit or not, as the slicks card stock, print quality, and cartridge hold up under close scrutiny and appear to be legitimate. Funds from piracy may be funnelled into organised crime and terrorism. I would like to highlight the "may" in the above title. The reason being, while these claims have been made by some officials, I have found no substantial articles that point to any particular group or hard evidence of it occurring. The purported reasoning is that these organisations see this as an easy way to fund their other agendas. My personal belief is that this does occur, but would only make up an extremely small portion of worldwide piracy (and even then, I'd weight it more towards organised crime than terrorism). For the most part I expect mass pirates to be in it to make money at someone elses expense, but I'm sure this aspect does exist. The following is from AFACT website (Australian Federation Against Copyright Theft) Police jurisdictions recognize organized crime involvement in film piracy. Organized crime links to movie piracy in Australia were first uncovered following a raid on Malaysia-linked movie pirates in 2002. While not organized crime, various reports have pointed to some sellers as being involved in other criminal activity, including selling unlicensed/child pornography, drug trafficking, other counterfeits, and owning illegal firearms. This information is from AFACT; I'm sure similar organizations in your country will have similar reports.
«Dart» Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 wall text así que solo leí los dos primeros... xD
b52|Hunhau Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 Dejando de lado cualquier valor moral o etico que se pueda hacer sobre la pirateria, creo que si hay algo fundamental, y es que la industria tambien tiene que adaptarse al cambio de cierta manera, y meterse en la cabeza que los viejos modelos donde el consumidor simplemente aceptaba lo que le daban ya no sirven. Creo que las industrias involucradas deberian revisar sus practicas y tratar de buscar medios alternos, o innovaciones para llegarle de una mejor manera al usuario, en vez de estar buscando cada vez mas maneras de ownearse a los mismos. Un quote de Trent Reznor sobre su uso de Oink, un tracker de torrents que se hizo algo famoso: "I'll admit I had an account there and frequented it quite often. At the end of the day, what made OiNK a great place was that it was like the world's greatest record store. Pretty much anything you could ever imagine, it was there, and it was there in the format you wanted. If OiNK cost anything, I would certainly have paid, but there isn't the equivalent of that in the retail space right now." PD: lo vi mas por el lado de la musica, pero bueno.
b52|Hunhau Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) iTunes tiene un monton de restricciones, pasando por el DRM, hasta el bajo bitrate de una parte de las canciones que venden. El punto es que Ud tiene que aceptar varias cosas al comprar ahi. Edit: semantica + comentario extra. Edited September 2, 2008 by b52|Hunhau
CR12345 Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 "Christians Rock Hard" -- Ese episodio es un clásico!
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 Steam, direct2drive, ea link, gamespot dloader se llama Mr. Reznor
b52|Hunhau Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Alguno de esos es de musica? Edit: sorry por el fork a musica si esto era solo de software. Edited September 2, 2008 by b52|Hunhau
weijung Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 hum... viva la pirateria haha no varas, bueno, la verdad ##### it... yo compro las peliculas y los juegos que me gustan. fok the reviews, fok las criticas, yo los bajo y si me gustan lo compro. Punto asi de facil.... La vara es que en Costa Rica, las tiendas son unos malditos ladrones hi.... de todo. Que cobran como 50mil o mas por un juego... Y que le queda a uno, mandarlo a traer y tras de eso q se lo cojan los mops de Aerocasillas... asi que si el juego me gusta lo mando a traer. Hasta que los ladrones aca dejen de cobrar tanto por todo me importa un bledo lo que diga este mae...!! Francamente yo he bajado un monton de juegos que lo instalo lo juego como 30mins y no me gusta.. imaginese si uno se pone a comprar esas porquerias :S, maxime con el monton de juegos malos que han sacado ultimamante. Ahora, en PS3 la verdad ha sido mas tuanis, bajo demos del PSStore y los pruebo y si me gusta lo compro. De hecho de como 30 juegos de PS3 que he bajado solo me ha gustado como 3 o 4 haha. Igual con TV series, yo he comprado los que me han gustado, compro como 1 season de alguna serie de las q me gusta por mes, y eso que ya los he bajado y visto. Asi que es cuestion de cada quien, a mi me gusta apoyar las buenas cosas que han creado. Pero si obligan a la gente, muchos van a optar por la pirateria. PS: ojala que abran un video donde alquilen juegos de PS3 en CR xD jajaja
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Sí yo recuerdo los buenos tiempos cuando alquilaba juegos de Genesis por plaza del sol, era de mis lugares favoritos para visitar ese lugar. Y obvio, comprar un juego en Costa Rica es un ridículo y NADIE lo debería hacer, por eso dije las diferentes alternativas que hay y que están creciendo muchísimo últimamente... Y hunhau nombré esos lugares xq estamos en GamingCR... Mi tema es orientado a gaming no música... Aunque sí... Es el mismo caso con la música... Edited September 2, 2008 by betoelbicho
Juancho Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 Me acuerdo cuando bajaba musica con mi conexion de 56k. si bien bajaba musica underground(oigase reggaeton del 98-2002, era mas rap que la charanga horrible que hay hoy), solo encontre una tienda que vendia los cds que yo andaba buscando y en ese tiempo no aceptaban la tarjeta de credito que yo tenia. asi que los baje de napster y de irc. El problema con los juegos es un poquito mas complicado que eso. si un juego sale en usa y cuesta 60$ aqui lo venden en 60 mil colones. me acuerdo de haber visto doom 3 en 54 mil colones. despues de que se baja en hype los juegos bajan de precio, los regalan junto con tarjetas de video, los meten en bundle packs, los regalan por el fin de semana etc. Aqui no, aqui la coleccion de battlefield 1942 cuesta 35 mil colones en amazon 9.99$. Ahi se quedara en el stand hasta que se pudra o hasta que algun operado lo compre.
kLorD Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) +1 weijung La gente de consola, Truco: alquilan juego en www.gamefly.com, se lo envían a PO Box(sale mas barato) luego piden comprarlo y se lo venden a precio de usado(ellos le envían cajita) y en general se ahorran plata xD antes servía, no se ahora Edited September 2, 2008 by DarKross
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 Me acuerdo cuando bajaba musica con mi conexion de 56k.si bien bajaba musica underground(oigase reggaeton del 98-2002, era mas rap que la charanga horrible que hay hoy), solo encontre una tienda que vendia los cds que yo andaba buscando y en ese tiempo no aceptaban la tarjeta de credito que yo tenia. asi que los baje de napster y de irc. El problema con los juegos es un poquito mas complicado que eso. si un juego sale en usa y cuesta 60$ aqui lo venden en 60 mil colones. me acuerdo de haber visto doom 3 en 54 mil colones. despues de que se baja en hype los juegos bajan de precio, los regalan junto con tarjetas de video, los meten en bundle packs, los regalan por el fin de semana etc. Aqui no, aqui la coleccion de battlefield 1942 cuesta 35 mil colones en amazon 9.99$. Ahi se quedara en el stand hasta que se pudra o hasta que algun operado lo compre. En general todo en Costa Rica es así... Si una tarjeta de video cuesta $400 aquí está en 400000, es un ridículo... Ahora todo eso no es justificación para piratería ya que hay otras alternativas... No puede ni debe ser.
kLorD Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) En general todo en Costa Rica es así... Si una tarjeta de video cuesta $400 aquí está en 400000, es un ridículo... Ahora todo eso no es justificación para piratería ya que hay otras alternativas... No puede ni debe ser.como dijó alguien por ahí compro y apoyo, pero no voy a dejar todo mi sueldo en eso.....además si yo compro un juego es MIO y puedo hacer con el lo que me plazca, alguna hora tienen que entender eso.... Edited September 2, 2008 by DarKross
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) si ud compra un juego ud tiene una copia nada más, no es suyo para hacer lo q le plazca... las reglas del software libre NO aplican para las cosas licenciadas fuera de ese ámbito (como los juegos)... ud no puede andar regalando la propiedad intelectual de otra personas Edited September 2, 2008 by betoelbicho
b52|Hunhau Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 La musica tambien es muy cara aca, y la oferta no es muy diversa que digamos. Hace tiempo no voy a una tienda de CDs, pero creo que andaban como por 9000 colones, mientras en Amazon u otro lado probablemente haya mejores precios y mas variedad (al menos en el caso de la musica que suelo comprar). Sorry si sigo en el tema, pero al fin y al cabo todos oimos musica... creo. No se muy bien como anda la politica fiscal y las leyes en cuanto a esto , pero, tecnicamente hablando, no deberian todos los paquetes que uno trae pagar cierta cantidad de impuestos? Creo que una vez que tomamos eso en cuenta lo de mandar a traer no sale tan tuanis, por eso cosas como Steam o iTunes o lo que sea suenan bien... pero igual, al menos en el caso de iTunes, uno debe atenerse a demasiadas restricciones.
kLorD Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Pues sea como sea es un bien por el que pago, si ellos ponen esas reglas es porque quieren hacer con nosotros lo que les de la gana.... asi que se jodan, dinero les sobra y muchos no..... Si ud quiere y puede comprar todos sus juegos originales bien por ud, yo compro algunos,los otros los intercambio y así.... a mi tambien me pasa mucho eso de instalar un juego y desinstalarlo a la media hora...que desperdicio habría hecho si fueran originales BTW iTunes SUX demasiado, incluso el reproductor por si solo es una crap Edited September 2, 2008 by DarKross
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 Obviamente no comprar todos los juegos q se le vengan a la mente, eso es ridículo y tonto. Para eso hay demos, trials, reviews, etc. Y saladas las hijueputas compañías que ni eso saquen simplemente no se compra el juego y ya de nada se está perdiendo si no lo probó
MagnuS Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 BTW iTunes SUX demasiado, incluso el reproductor por si solo es una crap Está bien como tienda, pero como reproductor de MUSICA está sobrado, cuando uno tiene bastante música iTunes le simplifica la vida, a diferencia del centenar de reproductores pura shit que hay en el mercado.
betoelbicho Posted September 2, 2008 Author Report Posted September 2, 2008 Pues sí iTunes me parece un buen reproductor aunque odie a Apple, lol.
kLorD Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Steam, $50, hágalo ya ebay $30 en sus manos! , bueno yo tuve suerte xD Edited September 2, 2008 by DarKross
JOKER Posted September 2, 2008 Report Posted September 2, 2008 (edited) Bueno yo creo que al comparar los precios de las tiendas online para comprar los juegos o musica con los precios de las tiendas locales, y con eso decir que son unos careros es un poco apresurado, pues logico que al comparar precio si parece asi, pero yo veo los precios en si normales, cuando se toma en cuenta que tienen que pagar mantenimiento de local, empleados, impuestos de entrada del objeto así como impuestos de su venta, y aun asi obtener una ganancia, claro yo tampoco casi nunca compro aqui por que la diferencia es mucha, pero cuando uno toma en cuenta la gran cantidad de gastos que incurren los importadores, peor aun si no son importadores directos, es un poco logico los precios que ponen, yo un dia me puse a hacer calculos con un compa de los precios de los juegos o la musica, y si yo fuera dueño de un local como esos más o menos los precios serían como las de algunas tiendas ticas por lo menos para generar alguna ganancia, claro como en todo hay lugares donde se exceden, pero hay que ser comprensivos con los costos en que se incurren. Edited September 2, 2008 by JOKER
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